z:\ ambedkar\vol-02\vol2-06.indd MK SJ+YS 21-9-2013/YS-8-11-2013 483
EVIDENCE BEFORE SIMON COMMISSION 483
- Sir Hari Singh Gour: With regard to the case of the Bhungi which you mentioned, are you sure if he was not properly attired and therefore be was not allowed to get into the tram ?
Dr. Ambedkar: I do not know about that.
- Before a man gets into the tram he is not asked to which caste he belongs ; they only ask him whether he has got the fare, is it not ?
Dr. Ambedkar: But people can easily recognise him.
- That is on account of his dress ?
Dr. Ambedkar: But he will be dealt with very badly when once he is recognised to belong to the depressed classes.
- Apart from the question of caste there is also the question of costume ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes, but some of the members of the depressed class are very well dressed.
- In the Bombay Presidency you have no such thing as to consider it a pollution to walk in the shadow of a depressed class member ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes, it exists in some parts of the Konkan and in Kathiawad.
- It is on the wane ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes.
- With regard to the Ambalal Sarlal School in Ahmedabad, has not his sister started the school for depressed classes ?
Dr. Ambedkar: That is the only honourable exception.
- Is not the school maintained for the depressed classes from public funds ?
Dr. Ambedkar: I do not know that, but I know that that lady is taking interest in the elevation of the depressed classes.
- Chairman: I understand it is an exceptional case ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes, it is quite an exceptional case.
- Dr. Suhrawardy: In view of the instances of social ostracism and tyranny which you have just stated, do you not think that in a general election members of your community will be frightened out of the polling booths ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes, it may happen.
- Also there is the further apprehension that the high caste-Hindus may refuse to come and participate in the elections where the untouchables go to record their votes ?
Dr. Ambedkar: They might; it is very difficult to say what might happen. We have cases, for instance, where the caste-Hindu members of district boards have left the premises because the depressed class members have claimed to sit at the table.
- Do you not think that, in view of this state of affairs, it will be better for you to have a separate electorate because in practice it will mean a separate electorate even if you reserve your seats in a general electorates ?
Dr. Ambedkar: Yes.